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24 June 2009 @ 07:26 pm
everyone has the right to arm bears  
I attended my first yoga class today. It was free! (I'm going to miss that aspect of being a student. The huge downside to having a paying job is, you know, paying for things.) It was equal parts 'Hmm' and 'OW' with a side of corny when she read us a relaxation mantra. But because the warning wank was on my mind, this part struck me particularly:

Breathe in compassion and you breathe out joy.

Hokey, non? But it got me thinking.

There are two aspects to the anti-warning stance that absolutely kill me. The first is that people are reading about other people's pain, other people's horrible experiences, other people's battles and are still all 'YEAH BUT I DON'T CARE.' PTSD is very real, you guys. (I got a 1H in psychiatry; I should know! No really. I should.) I'm not sure where triggering fits in the DSM-IV or the ICD-10, because we didn't study them in depth, but you can be certain it's there. Even if it had no name or international classification ... pain is pain.

In a year's time I, and 140 of my compatriots, will become qualified doctors. A lot of them during their psychiatry rotations expressed the view that mental illness is 'all in their heads.' This statement bothered me because of its UTTER STUPIDITY. Where is any illness except in your head? And why, because it has no physical manifestation, is it downgraded so? That's another day's debate, but the way the anti-warning people are dismissing triggering pain makes my blood boil. Everyone has a different pain threshold, mentally and physically. I stub my toe and it's like I'm being crucified; other people could have their toenails pulled and not wince. Pain is a spectrum, you fools, not a constant. No one has the right to decide what qualifies pain for anyone but themselves.

And then there's the part where they talk about 'just clicking out of the page if it bothers you.' Even leaving aside the fact that a triggered person actually cannot do this - speaking from the POV of someone without triggers, please tell me, HOW DO I FORGET ALL THE UPSETTING STUFF I'VE HAD OCCASION TO READ THROUGH THE YEARS? I may be able to click out of the page, but I can't X my memory. Also see: people are idiots.

The other thing that makes me frof at the mouf is the argument constantly trotted out by the anti-warningers - that warnings don't exist in popular media, books, TV and films. (Except for how they sort of DO.) As I was saying to Marks, this is our space. WE INVENTED IT. It's one of the few places where females are in the majority, where females hold all the positions of power, and you want to revert it to a patriarchical system? Wow, that's a ... valuable life choice, right there. xkcd said it best: We're adults now. WE GET TO DECIDE WHAT THAT MEANS.

It's interesting to note that quite a few of the most stringent anti-warningers mention how they themselves were abused. I wonder if their lack of compassion towards other victims/survivors is due to a lack of compassion shown to them. It's not an excuse, but it's maybe a reason.

Breathe in compassion and you breathe out joy. Breathe in disregard for the feelings of others and what you breathe out pollutes everyone around you.

I'm sure some people are muttering into their hands about the lack of compassion I showed during a certain religious debacle. Hands up, I'm guilty. My sense of compassion has a huge blind spot when it comes to religion. It may take me my whole life to conquer that, but all I can say is that I'm trying.

Now is the time to tell me if anything of mine needs warning. I know I bumped off Harry a few times...
 
 
Current Mood: aggravatedaggravated
Current Music: the patient ferris wheel // the gaslight anthem
 
 
 
jehnt: disney - ponies!jehnt on June 24th, 2009 07:20 pm (UTC)
lol religion

Uh, otherwise, WORD.

In a year's time I, and 140 of my compatriots, will become qualified doctors. A lot of them during their psychiatry rotations expressed the view that mental illness is 'all in their heads.'

ugh HATE. (Also, umm, brain chemicals? Imbalances thereof? AREN'T THESE PEOPLE DOCTORS!?!?!??!???)

using baby unicorn icon BECAUSE I CAN.
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: iconomicons squished fairyscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:11 am (UTC)
sigh

AREN'T THESE PEOPLE DOCTORS!?!?!??!??

LOL NOT YET.

I maybe won't tell you about the many, many conversations I had with one guy wherein I tried to explain that no, depressed people just can't think themselves out of it. D:

THERE IS NEVER NOT A GOOD TIME FOR BB UNICORNS. :D :D Omg now I want to write a story about unicorns!!!
(no subject) - jehnt on June 25th, 2009 11:19 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - scoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:31 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - jehnt on June 25th, 2009 11:44 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - scoradh on June 25th, 2009 12:00 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Riakessie on June 24th, 2009 07:21 pm (UTC)
I... have clearly missed something again. No idea what's going on.
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: iconomicons lady patternsscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:16 am (UTC)
It is neatly summarised here. And don't worry! It's a bandom thing. Or was, initially.
(Anonymous) on June 24th, 2009 07:36 pm (UTC)
Thanks muchly for the sense making.

I am going to make a note for myself & stick to my monitor of this phrase, "Breathe in compassion and breathe out joy".

Thanks again!
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: iconomicons girl of lightscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:16 am (UTC)
No worries! Glad I could be of some help. :D
you do often seem cursedivyenglish on June 24th, 2009 09:56 pm (UTC)
I really like this post. ♥
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: anumberonme card stormscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:17 am (UTC)
IA with yours, too. This whole thing smacks of the crazy.
(Deleted comment)
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: anumberonme fainting couchscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:17 am (UTC)
NO U. :D
Online I'm a Giantparthenia14 on June 24th, 2009 11:16 pm (UTC)
This particular 'debate' has been startling in its sheer unpleasantness. There are are loads of warnings in popular fiction, TV and film FFS. Aargh I just can't.

And your fic is fine.
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: anumberonme lighted pathscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:18 am (UTC)
SERIOUSLY. The anti-warningers USE warnings, they just don't agree that warnings are a right or ... IDEK, their position is precarious at best.

Thanks. :D
a work in progresswintersjuly on June 25th, 2009 12:03 am (UTC)
In a year's time I, and 140 of my compatriots, will become qualified doctors. A lot of them during their psychiatry rotations expressed the view that mental illness is 'all in their heads.'

so the fact that i'm reading this, on the verge of tears because i've had psychiatrists treat me just like this is all in my head? the fact that i went in feeling awful and came out feeling worse is just all in my head?

thank god you're going to be an amazing doctor, thank god there are people like you in our health care system because i don't think i would have gotten so much better without you all ♥
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: anumberonme tea party gunscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:19 am (UTC)
Oh man, I'm so sorry to hear that. I mean, it helps me from a compassion POV that I have depression myself, but if I hadn't had doctors that were just 'Yup, here are some pills, here is some therapy' I don't know what I would have done.

And don't worry, I have no hesitation TOSing a bitch when less well-informed people get it wrong. :D
Maple: Alien Lovemaple_mahogany on June 25th, 2009 12:18 am (UTC)
It is very much an issue of compassion. I really struggle with how that is such a difficult concept. 'Do onto others' - you don't want to get sucked into reading something you wouldn't like, so don't do it to others.

I'm glad to know that a future doctor is understanding this concept. Being thrust into such daily tedium it's easy for medical personnel to lose touch with compassion.
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: anumberonme true lovescoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:22 am (UTC)
It is quite as simple as that. I'm so, so lucky that things don't trigger me, but I still appreciate it when fics are well-labelled so I can avoid scenarios I don't enjoy. And these people are so DUMB. They might not warn, but anyone rec'ing or del'ing - it's the first thing they'll mention!

It can be totally exhausting. But, you know, I always think 'This might be the 50th patient I've seen, but I'm the first doctor they've seen.'
not just posh nosh!: gerard OHWHUTyellsurprise on June 25th, 2009 01:04 am (UTC)
I have to say that this whole thing has startled me- seriously? Bandom? I thought we were better than that.

every Starbucks should have a polar bear: halowrites: pink doughnutscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:23 am (UTC)
I think we all did. :(
and that was the beginning of fairies: Gabenyx_nox on June 25th, 2009 01:17 am (UTC)
I want to quote you back at you so much. Probably also say "this" a lot. ♥♥!
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: halowrites: tiger kittenscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:23 am (UTC)
:D The cobra also agrees!
real men love discotakkatakkatakka on June 25th, 2009 08:46 am (UTC)
I... appear to have missed something. People are trying to argue 'against' warnings?

That just seems ignorant and lazy. Why would you choose to risk triggering someone just because you can't - what? Be bothered to type out less than a sentence of information? Please tell me they're giving some other reason than those. Are they worried it'll spoil the story or something similar?


I really adore how you write, even in non-fiction pseudo debates like this.
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: halowrites: pink heart biscuitsscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:27 am (UTC)
It's all here, but don't read if you like your blood pressure the way it is.

As far as I can gather, these people feel that warnings:
1. Unnecessarily coddle victims of rape who should suck it up and get other people to vet their fic for them.
2. Impinge on their 'artistic integrity.'
3. Spoil plot twists/ruin the impact of plot twists.

Wonderful arguments all round, I'm sure you'll agree. Really, there's not enough D: in the WORLD.

♥!
(no subject) - takkatakkatakka on June 25th, 2009 04:09 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Sereniaserenia on June 25th, 2009 09:01 am (UTC)
I'm all for warnings on some things. I have on occasion been very, very upset reading or seeing things about people hurting cats or kids. On the other hand, there is plenty that doesn't bother me that would bother others, like medical stuff and TMI.

I don't think there's been anything I've seen in your journal that I thought needed a warning.
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: iconomicons choose wiselyscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:28 am (UTC)
Yes, but the crux of the argument here regards NON-CON, DUBCON, RAPE and VIOLENCE. And people actually think they shouldn't be warned for, even though people with triggers have pointed out how disturbing they find reading such things. UGH THESE PEOPLE SUCK.

Good, good. I'm hyper-sensitive about it now.
(no subject) - serenia on June 25th, 2009 11:31 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - scoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:32 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - serenia on June 25th, 2009 11:53 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - scoradh on June 25th, 2009 12:01 pm (UTC) (Expand)
mrsquizzical: bandom panic spencer zackmrsquizzical on June 25th, 2009 09:06 am (UTC)
the blind spot is an issue to me because of the compassion thing. but the fact that you recognise that and are willing to address that aspect of it is more than can be said for a lot of people with more moderate views.

and as for the rest of what you said? i agree very strongly. thanks for saying something, sweetheart.
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: Darcy'd do himselfscoradh on June 25th, 2009 11:29 am (UTC)
I just try and think it out whenever the issue comes up. And really, if keeping my mouth shut is all I can do, I'll do it.

Merit: LotRmeritjubet on June 25th, 2009 01:16 pm (UTC)
Ahh, people, how you fail so at life sometimes. I read the original post shortly after it came out was like, "this makes so much sense!" I didn't realise there were still people who didn't warn about dubcon etc. What a sheltered part of fandom I've been residing in.
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: collapsingnight pink treescoradh on June 25th, 2009 02:29 pm (UTC)
I was pretty sheltered too. That, or I wasn't surrounded by THOUSANDS OF ASSHOLES. D:
dirtylaughdirtylaugh on June 27th, 2009 08:17 pm (UTC)
Bumping off Harry should always be warned about, as it is MASSIVE incentive to read a fic.

Um.
every Starbucks should have a polar bear: Art: blue bustierscoradh on June 29th, 2009 07:01 pm (UTC)
Thousands would ... not agree. :D